Wednesday, May 02, 2012
What does OWS & ice-fishing have in common?
Not much. I lost alot of respect for them when they stopped protesting throughout the winter months. Sure some judge told them they can't camp out in Zuccotti Park anymore but what was it? by late December or early January they weren't even in the news anymore probably replaced by some Kardashian crap and the latest political scandal. Lost alot of steam imo by hibernating like this, even the 'possum risks ice-frost every now and then to get a bite to eat. The brave May Day protests to shut down work, schools and banks, expect more brave protests throughout the summer months, probably into the fall as well. This blogpost is not about whether you agree or disagree with them, you probably don't and will comment as you see fit but real protesters protest in whatever kind of weather. 12 degress in the middle of January, you're out there with your frozen snot and a chapped ass, a rumbling belly because you're body expelled all that fine OWS cuisine and you have to use the Port-o-San at least 10X because you had a couple cups 'o' joe when you woke up in the morning, now that's Democracy in action and I can respect that politics be damned! They really need to watch reels of those old-time black civil-rights protesters from the 60's getting pushed back by fire hoses and bitten by German Sheperds these hippy/yuppie hybrid malcontents. Bunch 'o' pussies, meteorological cowards. They don't make protesters like they used to:)
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I need to make a lunchtime comment here. The anniversary of Roe v Wade occurs every Jan. 22nd and in D.C. every year busloads of pro-lifers come to demonstrate (peacefully, no crapping on cop cars) and they do this no matter how friggin' cold it gets (and in January, it usually is pretty cold!)
ReplyDeleteSo yes, I agree, these OWS are pussies (remember we couldn't use that word in Hannityland? Blogging is so much better!)
You couldn't even use the word "cocktails" @ Hannityland without the first word being etched out. That's a good point about the pro-lifers and I remember reading in the papers during some years on Jan. 22 the weather was quite awful. Now let's say the OWSers protested even during the bitterest winter days even if you didn't share their politics/ideology it'd have to impress you so I'd think at some upper levels of OWS if they were a smart movement they'd say let's get out there people!! The behavior though, dunno how throwing buckets of feces in an ATM lobby is supposed to get people on your side and the other question is who supplies this stuff in the first place?
ReplyDeleteNote to that Blow-Hard Soapbox derby! Suck it up and remember This is not a "Sit-It-Out-And-Pout" election. This is a "Get-Obama-Out" election
ReplyDeleteNote to Jarhead.
ReplyDeleteSimply Suck it.
I'm really sick and tired of the lame excuses that these Lids come up with about why we must vote for Obama and about how bad Mitt Romney is.
ReplyDeleteThere people are either deaf or blind or both. How can anyone believe that Obama would not disappoint us after the poor job and all the failed policies that he has had in the past 3 and a half years!
Obama continues to say what progressives want to hear and then blames Bush's policies over and over again.. He's 2 faced plain and simple and the country is no better off than it was before he took office, in fact maybe worse!!
The liberals won't admit it but they got suckered in by Obama. I think the country is worse off now than ever before in our history.
So we don't vote for Romney because he somehow doesn't pass soapie's libertarian purity test, so that in effect helps Obama win a 2nd Term and so libertarianism somehow helps the growth of liberalism in the end. I'm not getting the tactical strategy here.
ReplyDeleteZ-man said...
ReplyDeleteSo we don't vote for Romney because he somehow doesn't pass soapie's libertarian purity test.
Mitt Romney is going to be the republican candidate, that is a fact...period. There is literally nothing you or I can do to change that reality. It is what it is.
In short, a Romney presidency would be miles better than an Obama second term.
If Obama were re-elected
Obamacare would NOT be repealed.
Government dependency, which is already at record levels, will continue to climb.
The Military and the entire Defense Department will be gutted so much that America will no longer be a superpower.
Obama will appoint even more liberal Supreme Court justices, and you know what that will do.
You could count on Amnesty for illegal immigrants.
So who cares about anyone’s libertarian purity test? I surely don’t.
"In short a Romney presidency would be miles better than an Obama presidency."
ReplyDeleteThat's the way I see it and as Romney says Obama wants to make a government-centered society. See his "Story of Julia" on his website showing how government has helped this fictitious woman through all the stages of her life.
'Real protesters protest in whatever kind of weather'
ReplyDelete..couple thoughts, in Seattle where it is just damp in winter,
the anarchist/thug types break
windows and tip over cars. They
aren't protesting, just taking the opportunity to do criminal mischief.
..as to weather, having survived
a campout in January up the American Fork River in Utah (go up the highway til they have quit plowing and you see a 10 ft wall of snow), it took a week to thaw out. Felt like William Clark of the Lewis & Clark band when they
reached the summit of Lolo Pass-
"I have been wet and cold in every part as I ever was in my life, indeed I was at one time fearfully my feet would freeze in the thin mockersons which I wore"
..gonna save my protesting for
sunny summer days...
Note to cwhiatt
ReplyDeleteA refusal to vote or a vote for a third party is nothing but a vote for Obama. Put aside bigotry towards the unholy LDS and consider that you are voting against Obamanation/Obamanazi
Mexico has issued the U.S. government what amounts to a diplomatic threat for exonerating a Border Patrol agent who shot an illegal immigrant near the Texas border nearly two years ago after being assaulted with rocks.
ReplyDeleteThe Mexican Government is almost as laughable as the Obama administration on this matter. For Mexico to be trying to tell America what to do with it’s policies is a joke. They need to reinvent their Country and grow some brains down there. Quit growing all the drugs and take the fields back and grow crops. Put your people to work and quit encouraging them to illegally cross the border so that their people can work in the USA stealing Americans children’s futures and make something of Mexico. Let them take all their drugs, and criminals, and their job stealing illegals back that are not supposed to be here in the first place.
I am all for blowing away any invader that tries to harm any of our troops or border patrol agents down there. This aint the Alimo and it never will be again! Go Home!!!By refusing to secure our borders, this President has failed us all again!
This message is meant for the
ReplyDeleteLibertarian Ron Paul supporter who seems to think that His shit don't stink!
Libertarianism is a modern form of a political person with a a sociopath personality, racism, and a dash of cowardly actions.
Roll that all up and throw in a dash of lack of morality and you have your Modern Liberal
Stealing American children's futures?
ReplyDeleteI tell you what.
If those children or anyone unemployed would like to do the jobs our local Mexicans do I am sure the local farmers would be happy to hire them.
You'll have a variety of opportunities available. If you'd like to work locally you can plant, hoe, and prime tobacco. Those jobs are done by hand. If you'd like to work in Virginia you can also choose cabbage. This is twelve hours a day, six days a week, until the season's over, and you'll get minimum wage. There is a daily minimum standard, so if you can't keep up, you're out of a job. (Just fair warning.)
Please come and apply-there are plenty of positions available for those who are willing to work them. I know the farmers will be happy to have you.
Oh, I forgot: temperatures in the field routinely top 110. You provide your own hat and sunscreen. Don't forget to pack your cooler full of lunch. Once you get to where you're working, that's where you stay til the day is done.
ReplyDeleteThe farmers are waiting for you. They would love to hire Americans...but none are willing to work a job like this. They'd rather sit at a computer and cry that Mexicans are stealing American children's futures. Yep. One acre of tobacco at a time, I guess....
Bull shit
DeleteRE: "By refusing to secure our borders, this President has failed us all again!" Say what?
ReplyDeleteThe numbers are staggering:
• 1.5 million deportations in the last four years, a record high.
• A 70 percent increase in the number of convicted criminals deported.
• Arrests at the border up 14 percent in the past two years.
• An 85 percent increase in border agents since 2004.
• 31 percent more drugs and 63 percent more weapons seized at the border.
• 650 miles of border fence now completed.
..research the numbers-this is the first president to actually do
something about it.
"So we don't vote for Romney because he somehow doesn't pass soapie's libertarian purity test, so that in effect helps Obama win a 2nd Term and so libertarianism somehow helps the growth of liberalism in the end. I'm not getting the tactical strategy here."
ReplyDeleteMaybe you should move to a caucus state where you have to actually get off your fucking ass and do something meaningful beyond tuning in to propaganda and regurgiating and promoting it.
Saty, same thing in California, but people are unwilling or unable to face those facts.
ReplyDeleteThere was one company in Riverside, a landscaping company, that would only hire US workers... at $25.00 an hour and could not get US workers to come and dig ditches in the hot weather for that rate.
It is a myth that Americans will do those jobs anymore than they will work in chicken processing plants.
But propagate them people will.
The other side of this is that people are also unwilling to acknowledge that the US has systematically wiped out subsistence corn farmers in Mexico and is currently killing off the sugar cane industry through the use of government subsidized (dare I say this reeks of socialism) corn syrup (HFCS).
The problems, and solutions are very complex and do not lend themselves to easy fixes or slogans.
Z-man... I agree, if you are going to protest... stick it out. Like those US soldiers years ago in Washington agitating for their pay after WW I.
It's so much easier to say things like 'Mexicans are stealing our children's futures' and that 'the President has refused to secure our borders' than to face unpleasant facts; that Americans WILL NOT DO the jobs that Mexicans are doing, that the President is doing a GOOD JOB. It's easier to make up all kinds of nonsense and yell it really loudly. It's easier to not have to deal with facts, to ignore facts, to call people who put out facts all kinds of names.
ReplyDeleteface unpleasant facts; that Americans WILL NOT DO the jobs that Mexicans are doing, that the President is doing a GOOD JOB. It's easier to make up all kinds of nonsense and yell it really loudly. It's easier to not have to deal with facts, to ignore facts, to call people who put out facts all kinds of names.
ReplyDeleteThat is entirely nonsense, it's the same BS that Obama WANTS us to believe!
And cwhiatt STICK IT!
Then why is it that the farmers have to hire Mexicans in NC? Why is it that the crops rotted in the fields when Georgia and other states came down on immigration? They couldn't get anyone to do the work. Americans won't do this work, not even the unemployed ones.
ReplyDeleteCome and live where I live, where Mexican migrant workers keep the economy rolling. See how many Americans are willing to do the jobs they do for the money they get for doing them. The answer is NONE.
You may comfort yourself with denials, but you're living in fantasy.
And, as I am sure Chris will confirm, this is an example of the free market at work:
ReplyDelete1. Americans need jobs.
2. Mexicans in America need jobs.
3. Migrant worker jobs are available.
4. Mexicans are willing to work for the money offered.
5. Americans are not willing to work for the money offered.
6. Farmers hire the Mexicans.
7. Americans bitch that Mexicans are stealing American jobs.
If you want the work, call me; I can hook you up. Tobacco just went in; they're needing people go get out there and hoe down those rows. There are hundreds of thousands of acres of tobacco in this county, and every row gets hoed by hand. Plenty of work; 12 hours a day, 6 days a week, $7.25/hr.
Come on down.
Don't hold your breath Saty... some are more enamored of talking points than facts and solutions.
ReplyDeleteCW, it's hard to argue with that kind of logic, isn't it?
Oh, and if you're planning on working for priming, you're responsible for bringing your own gloves. Your call, but without them, you'll get nicotine poisoning.
ReplyDeleteRemember: this job doesn't come with health insurance. Gloves are cheaper than emergency room visits.
And not only all of the above, but anyone who's worked with a Mexican crew (agricultural or otherwise) will tell you they have an unbelievable work ethic and will work rings around anyone, no matter how hard the work, no matter what the weather.
ReplyDeleteEven Z will admit that.
Maybe you are talking about DEADBEAT AMERICANS! The lazy Americans that don't want to work.
ReplyDeleteBut there are PLENTY of Americans who are in the need for work and would do these jobs you are referring to.
Yes, they are doing jobs for less wages and because of that the American worker can't compete with them. They are also lowering the salaries of the jobs. In the meat market, in construction, etc. these were jobs done by Americans and the pay was good, now it is done by illegals and the salaries are very low and we still pay the same prices for the meat or houses the we buy. In other words the corporations that hired illegals are making big profits with the hiring of illegals.
Maybe some greedy employers who want to keep their overhead down and their profits up will hire Mexicans and pay them off the books so that they don't have to pay taxes, health insurance Social security and the rest of the overhead involved. .
They need to go back to Mexico where they came from and this misery of a president Obama needs to tighten down the border more...so that they can't get in and they steal jobs, medical, food... they can't even speak or read english and we are giving them jobs.. what a freaken joke, Had we have people like Dave here defending these LAW BREAKERS!
If the illegals were NOT here the jobs would still get done. The fastfood would still be servered, the lawns would still be mowed, the pools would be cleaned , the meat packing plants would still process meat, the children would still be watched, the homes would still get cleaned.It may cost a little more but the jobs WOULD be done.
@Dave, yest it is.
ReplyDeleteYou can hope for change. You can vote for change. You can listen for change.
Or...
You can be the change.
Some of these folks need to get some irons in the fire.
Schumick
DeleteIf Americans won't do a job it's because of the stupid entitlement mentality courtesy of the leftists on both sides of the aisle. Why work when you can get 99 weeks of unemployment?
ReplyDeleteBeth got it right
ReplyDeleteDarth, I've reread my comments many times, and I cannot find a statement where I defend illegal immigration.
ReplyDeleteI do see where I stated some of the facts behind why I feel it is happening.
Let me ask you, and the other conservatives here a question...
Is it in the best interests of America to promote international policies that cause unemployment to rise and millions of jobs to be lost in the country of one of our neighbors?
If your answer is yes, because we have the right to do whatever we want for the good of our country, would you support and affirm that right in other countries?
Not with illegals
ReplyDeleteIf Americans were willing to get out in 110 degrees and work tobacco, NC would not have the unemployment rate it does.
ReplyDeleteGeorgia would not have seen its Vidalia crop rot in the field.
Tomatoes in Arkansas wouldn't have rotted in the field either.
So please, since you apparently know Americans who are willing to work 12 hours a day, 6 days a week, for minimum wage and no benefits for a limited period of time with no security, please send them to Person and Granville Counties, North Carolina. The tobacco is waiting.
What would YOU know about what AMERICANS want?
ReplyDeleteThe jobs are there.
ReplyDeleteIf people want to work, they'll come and work them.
Apparently, since they haven't come, they don't want the jobs.
Therefore, since there's no one else to hire, the farmers hire the Mexicans, who want to work.
If you know Americans who want to work, please let them know we have hundreds of thousands of acres of tobacco that need workers right now, today.
I realize this may be difficult for you, but I put it in the smallest words I could find.
What would YOU know about what AMERICANS want?
ReplyDeleteIs there a reason why I wouldn't?
Maybe you missed my comment, Saty, or maybe I didn't use the smallest words so you could understand, but my point is with 99 weeks of unemployment from our government, then many Americans would rather sit on their collective asses than do the work you suggested. In other words, tell the leftists in Congress and the White House to stop enabling laziness and get their asses down to North Carolina or the gravy train ends for them.
ReplyDeleteYes Beth, any able bodied man or woman who had lost a job paying even just 30k annually should be delighted to leave his home and uproot his family for the promise of making an annual salary of 15k.
ReplyDeleteWorking those long days at half his original salary should leave him plenty of time to develop his resume, seek another job, or start something new in our entrepreneur society.
I wish everyone was able to live in such a world where solutions were always easy to see.
If you lost your job, would you forgo unemployment ins. And move to pick tobacco if you could not find work in Ohio?
Or would you continue to look for work where you live?
NOW hold on a minute here!!! Saty said "if Americans were willing to get out in 110 degrees and work tobacco" and that's let's see 12 hrs./day 6 days/wk. PERFECT American to do the job and she lives right here in Nutley NJ and you all know who I'm talking about. PATRICIA KRENTCIL, the tanorexic woman.
ReplyDeleteSheesh,
Dave to 5ft3: "If you lost your job would you forgo unemployment ins. and move to pick tobacco if you could not find work in Ohio?"
ReplyDeleteI think that was Beth's whole point, with unemployment for 99 wks. your incentive to do just what you suggested would not be there. Also I had this thought with all these tobacco jobs out there it runs right up against the gov't/health movement's neverending campaign to get people to give up the smokes so seems kinda contradictory to me. Get all Americans to give up smoking, drive up the price of cigs and sin taxes, run those gory tv ads and all those Mexicans would be out of jobs. Rich!
This hasn't got a single thing to do with unemployment.
ReplyDeleteThis has been going on for decades; Americans will not do the work that the Mexicans will do. Americans will not get out there and work the crops long hours six days a week for minimums. And when Georgia got the brilliant idea of using prisoners to do the job, the farmers said the prisoners were worthless and didn't do a tenth of the job the Mexicans did.
This is not a new issue. What's new is that people are wanting to find a scapegoat, so suddenly Mexicans are 'stealing American jobs' and Americans won't do the work because of an 'entitlement mentality' that has something to do with unemployment.
No.
It has a lot to do with the fact that Americans in general look down on manual labor and 'blue collar' work.
And Mexicans kick American ass in the work ethic department.
Saty, you've hit on something I think is part of the problem.
ReplyDeleteAs a society, we have, in my opinion, devalued blue collar work. Kids are not growing up to be plumbers, electricians, window cleaners, mechanics, whatever.
If it means getting your hands dirty, and working hard, gringos aren't very interested in doing it.
Here's an example... my son works hard, at writing. He will never be able to change a garbage disposal, fix a broken faucet, or change a light switch. But he is steadily paying off his student loans by, are you ready for this? Tweeting!
That's right. My son gets paid by the top road cyclng magazine in Europe to tweet his thoughts on the Tour de France, Giro de Italia, La Vuelta, etc.
He saw no benefit in learning plumbing, or any other trade.
Z-man... as for that person with no incentive, working for $7.00 and hour is no incentive either. It is less than unemployment, and leaves someone with no time to look for another job.
Even without unemployment ins., I doubt, as Saty has pointed out, that many Americans would work that hard, for such little pay.
Fewer still would even be able to uproot a family and move for such a low paying job. It is just not financially possible, because you cannot support a family on that kind of salary.
People will move if there is a good job available, and as evidence, I offer the western Dakotas. They are paying upwards of $15.00 an hour to work at the golden arches because of a lack of quality people.
Those who stand against rules of Law are cowards.
ReplyDeleteDave - I did take a lesser job when I was out of work and continued to search for a full time job at the same time. I did not want to go on unemployment!
ReplyDeleteSaty, you will never admit that leftist policies simply don't work, but they don't. It's why things are going so poorly in our country right now! I wish people like you would wake up and realize that. You all have blinders on.
Darth, what are you talking about? In practice no one believes in the rule of law all the time.
ReplyDeleteFor instance, do you ever speed? And if so, are you flaunting the rule of law? Ever work on your home without getting the proper permits? Isn't that also flaunting and standing against the "rules of Law" as you put it?
My point is this... it is easy to say someone else stands against the rule of law and does not respect the law as we do here in the US. But the reality is that everyday Americans who say those things, by their actions, also do the very same thing.
As i've said many times, life is lived in the gray areas. Arguments are made in the black and white areas, and we all choose where we will stand...
Beth, I live in an area where the economy would collapse without the migrant workers.
ReplyDeleteGeorgia and other southern states that brought in immigration laws found that their agricultural economies also collapsed. Millions of dollars were lost as crops rotted in the fields for lack of people to come and harvest them. Americans were simply not willing to do that work. This has nothing to do with unemployment, entitlement, or any other imaginary scapegoat you'd like to dream up. It has everything to do with people who don't want to work their asses to the nub for pennies.
Those of us who live in reality, like Dave, understand this, and accept it for what it is, without feeling the need to pretend that it is what it is not.
Beth, I too did the same, but as you mentioned, you were able to continue to look for work. How would someone do that on the schedule Saty has referenced?
ReplyDeleteAlso, would you have been able to relocate to another state with your family to take that low paying job?
I'd like to see your reference for millions of crops rotting because nobody was there to harvest it, thanks.
ReplyDeleteDave Miller said...
ReplyDeleteDarth, what are you talking about?
I'm talking about being a Patriotic American, something YOU, or Satyavati devi dasi, (whatever her name is) knows nothing about! Like the little things that everybody here knows about but you two!
That's why I'm concerned and why you should be. I'm concerned about the economy and concerned about American jobs.
I read the writings of Thomas Jefferson, and NOT to Bill Maher or Malcolm X!
I listen to patriots the words crafted by the Fathers of this GREAT country not to the advice of it's tyrants.
America is on a downward path towards Socialism. What recourse will Americans take in November to preserve liberty that we enjoy here? We can no longer continue to sit on our butts and just accept the status quo.
Sure thing Beth. www.guardian.co.uk/world/2011/oct/14/alabama-immigration-law-workers
ReplyDeleteThis is a particularly good example as the farmer mentions that onlt 2 americans showed up to apply and once hired tried to scam him by documenting 2 baskets tomatoes for eaach 1 they picked.
Enjoy the read. And Darth? Who defines partiotism? Is that a subjective thing? Do I need to link a dictionary to the word "subjective"?
There are plenty more examples of the harvest problem but I have tech issues linking with the crackberry.
ReplyDeleteSatyavati devi dasi said...And Darth? Who defines partiotism? Is that a subjective thing?
ReplyDeleteIf you mean patriotism and not "partiotism"!
And if I can answer for Darth...
Certainly NOT YOU! You wouldn't know patriotism if it jumped up and bit you in your ass.
I'd sooner work with a bunch of Mexicans and Asians any day of the week. They work their asses off and the Asians are polite and respectfully obey orders, they don't gossip when they should be working but that's my thing. I too like Beth have taken jobs I didn't particularly like rather than go on the dole. I myself like outdoor work.
ReplyDeleteYou link leaves some unanswered questions, like how much notice did the farmer have that he'd have to find legal workers, and when he did, it doesn't mention that he advertised to get some but only mentioned 2 that came by looking for work. To me, if he was going to lose $100,000, then why not spend more to get the legal workers he needed? Sounds pretty fishy to me. Maybe he could have offered more money for workers and still come out ahead instead of losing $100,000.
ReplyDeleteZ-man said...
ReplyDeleteI'd sooner work with a bunch of Mexicans and Asians any day of the week. They work their asses off and the Asians are polite and respectfully obey orders, they don't gossip when they should be working but that's my thing
That may be or may not be, BUT what has that got to do with taking jobs away from Americans?
The debate here is are illegal immigrants really taking jobs away from American workers or not? I say that they are. In this country, we as American citizens are required to follow the law whether we agree with it or not. Sound familiar to anybody? So with that in mind, What part of “illegal” is so hard to understand?
American workers are put in a disadvantage when having to compete with ILLEGAL’S. We pay taxes, social security, unemployment and not it’s going to be even worse under Obamacare! Mexican’s or anyone else who may be working here illegally, aren't paying any taxes at all.. And to add to that, the employers also benefit by hiring illegal immigrants off the books. When having an employee on the books that employer must pay social security & medicare deductions. So this also hurts our social security system!
As for American's not wanting to take these jobs, and that the Mexican’s will do jobs that American’s won’t do, that’s myth. I don't think American's who are unemployed won’t take jobs that are beneath them.
The way that I feel is "AMERICA FIRST"!
Give me a break with this baloney about jobs Americans don t want. McDonald's just hired a large number of Americans who are apparently quite willing to do anything to feed Their families. Along with taking away jobs at fast food places, illegal’s take the jobs in hotels, restaurants, hospitality, transportation, factories and janitorial positions that our black citizens used to do and can no longer do because of the illegals which explains why black Americans have such a high unemployment rate. Add to that our returning veterans who now have close to zero chance of getting a job and trying to live an honest life while illegal’s from Mexico cross our border and get hired...I say close the borders. Period.
ReplyDeleteThere are already so many illegal’s in this country that the US government doesn't have the resources to get to even a fraction of them and they are still coming with no way to stop them, because nobody in the government wants to get the reputation of being the bad guy who wants to kick them out.. . The US government ignores the problem as if it didn't exist. Just like the deficit. Hey if congress is going to spend.....lets get a good fence up with razor wire like prisons between the borders and hire more guards to guard these borders.
Also, these immigrants crowd our emergency rooms when they get sick at the expense of the tax payer which adds to our healthcare costs. Before the recession there were way more immigrants than needed for farm work. They started taking jobs in construction because they pay better.
Not only are they draining our healthcare system, their also draining our education system as well. I wonder how many of them are working under the table? That drains our tax system as well. The worst part is that they don't spend their money here ether. They send it home to Mexico.
So, Secure our borders and keep illegals out...
Here is a very interesting statistic..
According to the Justice Department’s National Drug Threat for 2010, “Nineteen percent of youth aged 12 to 17 report past year illicit drug use.” The assessment said that Mexican drug trafficking organizations are now the predominant supplier of illegal drugs in the United States.
Nancy Pelosi has acknowledged that. So, a note to Obama. Stop threatening Arizona with law suites etc, and stop making jokes at their expense. And start providing the security they need to have. That’s your JOB, so do it!
Z-man, congratulations on getting to 50 comments!
ReplyDeleteNow I am going to pour some gas on the fire for you...
Why should the US government restrict a companies right to hire whomever they desire? That to me sounds like regulation.
In theory, isn't it just good business sense to try and pay the cheapest cost possible for labor?
This is just to say that people who rail against regulations and restrictions on business are totally for them, when they agree with them.
Just like those who claim we are a country of laws and that people need to abide by those laws, seldom think they apply to them, if they decide otherwise, as in speed limits, talking on cell phones while driving, and getting proper building permits.
Each of those three are probably some of the most violated laws we have in this country of laws, and you can bet, it ain't just the liberals that are doing the violating.
Little Red, I am sure many returning veterans could just move to the Carolinas, the Central Valley of California, or the Yakima Valley of Washington tomorrow and get a job picking whatever.
If Americans want those jobs, they are there for the taking. And that will be one less job for someone here illegally.
However, unless and until Americans step up and demand those jobs, along with meat packing and chicken processing jobs, yes... Mexicans will continue to do those jobs and feed their families.
Good business to get the cheapest labor?
DeleteEven it's illegal ?????
Dom't you understand what Illegal means?
Here are some more references for you, Beth.
ReplyDeletehttp://blog.al.com/wire/2011/10/chandler_mountain_farmers_comp.html
http://blog.al.com/wire/2011/10/crackdown_on_illegal_immigrant.html
Financial incentives aimed at getting unemployed Georgians and even criminals on probation to take their place picking crops were marginally successful, Black said, because the new workers were too slow and often quit because of the strenuous labor involved.
"A robust agricultural guest worker program, properly designed, will not displace American workers," Black said in remarks prepared for the hearing. "As my testimony shows, in Georgia, even with current high unemployment rates, it is difficult for farmers to fill their labor needs."
http://www.palmbeachpost.com/news/cerabino-crops-rot-as-georgia-feels-effects-of-1603304.html
"We don't have a workforce," said Bryan Tolar, the president of the Georgia Agribusiness Council, a group that represents about 700 farmers and agricultural businesses in that state. "Where are we supposed to get it?"
Wait a second. Isn't unemployment in Georgia as high as 14 percent in some farming communities?
"I think there are people here who can do it," Tolar said. "But we can't find people who will do it."
There are about 11,000 unfilled fieldworker jobs, Tolar said, and despite posting the job openings at the state's labor offices, they remain unfilled. The pay range is about $8 to $12 an hour.
http://www.theatlantic.com/business/archive/2011/06/georgias-harsh-immigration-law-costs-millions-in-unharvested-crops/240774/
http://www.thedemocraticstrategist.org/strategist/2011/05/gop_immigration_policy_labor_s.php
Enjoy.
You all can sit around and commiserate, and make yourselves feel better with rhetoric and talking points, but until you actually come and talk to the people who are involved, who are in the middle of this, who make this their livelihood, you're talking out your ass.
I'm sorry reality doesn't suit you, but the earth isn't flat and the sun doesn't revolve around it. I'm sorry.
Beth, did I see you say something back in the comments that sounds like forcing people to move someplace they don't want to move under threat of losing benefits?
ReplyDeleteget their asses down to North Carolina or the gravy train ends for them.
So, we should force people to uproot their families, leave their homes, and move places they don't want to move, or we take away their unemployment?
Wow... that's mighty fascist. And surprising only in its honesty.
So little Red, David has it all figured out for you. Please tell all those returning Hero's who just came home from having those Muslim a-holes soothing at them to pull up their roots, leave their homes and relatives and move to the Carolinas, or the Central Valley of California, or the Yakima Valley of Washington tomorrow and get a job picking whatever. I'm sure that Dave knows what he;s talking about, He sounds like an authority on "picking whatever"
ReplyDeleteSo all you returning Iraq and Afghanistan war veterans. David the Lib has it all figured out for you. No need to sweat it anymore
Oh by the way, I just checked it out.
The March 2012 Unemployment records show, SOUTH CAROLINA has 8.9% unemployment and NORTH CAROLINA has an unemployment rate of 9.7 percent.
I guess those returning war vets are too late!
Funny thing is here in NYC the jobless rate is still in double-digits esp. in the Bronx.
ReplyDeleteDave about your suggestion I believe it is still the law that a business can face penalties if they hire illegals after all they are breaking the law just like a business can't hire someone collecting a current disability check under Social Security. Speaking honestly here I'd have to say most Americans don't want to pick tobacco and if they're anything like my liberal cousin many will refuse to take even other jobs they consider beneath them. DD I was just observing that in my vast and varied workplace experience I find Latino and Asians to be the hardest workers as compared to many Americans' work ethics. Uh-oh I'm starting to sound a little liberal.
ReplyDeleteDarth, your response highlights the point I was making... It is unreasonable to expect people to uproot their families and move somewhere else for a job that will support them.
ReplyDeleteBut that is exactly what conservatives are calling for when they ask people on unemployment to move, or lose benefits.
If that is a good idea for a guy who gave his entire life to a company only to see his job taken away because he got too close to retirement vesting, downsizing, bad sales or whatever, why is also not a good idea for the vet?
The truth is that it is a bad idea for all, and we need to seriously think about jobs in this new economy that is globally linked.
Let's face it, manufacturing jobs are not going to be making a big comeback here in the US. And that includes all levels of manufacturing from shoes to tractors.
it is just cheaper to have foreign labor do that work and since a company has a fiduciary responsibility to always default to the higher profit option, that ain't gonna change soon.
Dude, Saty provided some quality links that pretty clearly argue against your primarily anecdotal stance. It is a fact... there are plenty of jobs here that Americans will not do. We may like that truth, but facts are facts, stubborn little things that they are.
I've asked this many times before across all sorts of blogs, both liberal and conservative and have yet to see many answers beyond the boiler plate elect this guy, or don't elect that guy, but I'll try again...
What practical suggestions, given the realities we face here in the US, both financially and politically, do you have for lowering unemployment and fixing our current economic mess?
Dave said: "Dude, Saty provided some quality links that pretty clearly argue against your primarily anecdotal stance. It is a fact... there are plenty of jobs here that Americans will not do. We may like that truth, but facts are facts, stubborn little things that they are."
ReplyDeleteThanks for making that clear to me, I don't know what I would do with out you
Ah, Mexicans, what would America do without them?
ReplyDeleteWe would do just fine. Most of us anyway. Some would actually have to pay a decent wage to their domestic help, others would have to contend with workers who might complain when exploited, and still more would have to do things that me and my neighbors do all the time for ourselves, like yard work, pumping the septic, cleaning the pool or growing our food.
Also our taxes would be less, there would be less criminal activity, less drunken drivers, much less drug trafficking less abuse of the system, fewer people driving with no insurance, there would be less disease, less crime, less peeing and defecating in our streets, more jobs, better educational system, more help for those Americans who really need it. It would be a better country and life would be better in every single way.
But, how on earth would Mexico survive without us?