Saturday, April 06, 2013
Some more post-Newtown thoughts,
since it's still percolating out there and the state of CT has just passed some of the strictest gun control laws in the nation. I only thought I'd do another Newtown thread if I have any fresh insights and so let's begin with the mathematics of Newtown. Now all these massacres of late within the last several years are being lumped together somehow but in the vast majority of shooting massacres grown adults are the victims. That's tragic enough but what happened at Sandy Hook is on another level totally IMO, a kind of existential quirk. In fact it's bizarre and I don't think there's a snapshot anywhere of Adam Lanza where he's not a bug-eyed bastard, such a joyless individual. Now the math angle, if you gun-controllers want to prevent another gun massacre ok but if your goal here is to prevent another Sandy Hook you're trying to prevent something that may not happen in another 150 years or ever for that matter. Another point - how did the post-Newtown debate/discussion somehow evolve into ONLY talking about guns and gun control with a healthy side of mental health and no mention of DRUGS whatsoever? meds, PCP, bath salts, prescription abuse, airplane glue, whatever but it's high past time authorities lay it all on the table so maybe we can have that other discussion. One senses just another generic post-gun massacre political debate with an angle or two being deliberately suppressed and I've been wondering why. Lastly since I'm trying to be fresh in this blog, to look at these things from another angle when you post comments I'd like some fresh and original thoughts too, maybe give yourself an aerial view of the issues instead of same-old same-old, left/right-wing talking points. NRA Bad, ok we get that but how can you legislate exactly against or to prevent the tragically bizarre which is what Newtown was? Conclusion: I'm not disagreeing with you about gun control per se but could Sandy Hook have been prevented? I'm gonna go with a no:)
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ReplyDeleteBack in the day, one kept a long gun for hunting. The current rage is for protection. The natural consequence is that we have 0.89
guns per capita, twice that of the
oft-compared Switzerland at .45
So there are a lot of personal weapons, which in itself should not be a problem, given responsible ownership. Israel and Switzerland both require registration-so that would seem
a reasonable step..sort of like
licensing cars. The Adam Lanzas,
James Holmes and Jared Laughners
are not that uncommon: most teachers and college professors
run across the type in typical
student bodies. However, far less than 1% disturbed people that make threats get to the point of carrying them out. Given the ubiquity of firearms and the rights of gun owners, and given
that folks can't be locked away
(except in very rare circumstance)
for being a perceived threat-small
wonder that legislation founders.
Armed school guards? How much does that cost, and is the US that bad
a place to live? Heck, Z-Man, we
can't even agree on whether Social Security should be public, private or even exist; and the divide is
even greater on the emotional POVs about firearms. My guess, the 'collateral damage' will continue...and so will the arguments.
Of course its easy to say that Sandy Hook could have been prevented, hindsight is always 20/20. I simply do not see how rational people think that mentally unstable individuals care two craps about gun laws, and will decide against doing harm to themselves or others because there are restrictions on guns. Seriously.
ReplyDeleteWith all due respect,Z-Man lets not stay focused on these Gun Control and Same Sex Marriage issues. This is exactly what this administration wants us to do.
ReplyDeleteWe can´t let Benghazi be swept under the rug. Keep it alive and in the news!
The families of the slain Hero's deserve more than the circus we witnessed in those hearings.
And we must NOT allow this wagging the Dog with Gay Marriages change our focus!
Hillary Clinton should be BOOED at every appearance she makes. And anyone who buys her books is an Idiot!
I really think that because people will always run red lights and stop signs that we should eliminate red lights and stop signs altogether. People aren't going to obey these things and so really, what's the point.
ReplyDeleteLOL, your attempt to make a point doesn't work, Saty, because nobody is saying get rid of all gun laws, but intelligent people know that more gun laws won't put an end to senseless killings from guns. If stricter gun laws worked, then Chicago would be the least likely place to be murdered, but that is not true. Try to look at facts before you respond, thanks.
ReplyDeleteBB: "The Adam Lanzas, James Holmes and Jared Loughners are not that uncommon"
ReplyDeleteHere's the common analytical mistake being made, you're lumping these three together. It could be that James Holmes and Jared Loughner would never shoot up an elementary school, to fire on a bunch of first-graders. In most of these cases it is presumed that the shooter has grievances against Society-at-Large, they resent adults generally and the kids have done nothing to them yet so they're not on their radar screen. Correct me if I'm wrong sir-BB but I don't recall a case where a shooter shut up a bunch of 20 5 and 6-yr. olds at least in this country. No I know you can probably dredge up something from the 1800's or something but I'm just sayin' this is extremely uncommon from a sociological POV compared to your average mass killer. The Lanza case is very different in some ways and you can't pass legislation just to address the rare and bizarre.
(spelling suffers when blogging after work)
ReplyDeleteSat of course we need those red lights and stop signs but gun control which I agree with in part is only a small, emphasis small part of the solution. Where I find fault with your average gun controller is they feel it's the biggest part of the solution. It's their unrealistic idealism that says if we just had enough laws on the books then Sandy Hook would never have happened. Were Life that simple!
I'm thinking, Z-Man, that the aforementioned 3 had a commonality in their culminating psychotic rage and ready access to choice of firearms. Certainly a case can be made that their root cause problems were quit different. It is
ReplyDeletevery easy in the US for such to obtain quite an arsenal and very
quickly. Tis the way it is, and as long as the state of affairs continues, we will have to accept
the 'collateral damage'...its almost as if we encourage it....
Excuse me, BB, how in the hell do we encourage this behavior, which as Z-man rightly points out is a rare occurrence?
ReplyDeleteYou know you've got to love the liberal mindset that says we can't outlaw abortions because then there will be back alley abortions still happening, but these same people think outlaw guns and everyone will follow that law.
I agree Beth. Outlawing abortion will move it to the back alley and surely the same for outlawing guns.
ReplyDeleteAre you saying we should do nothing about either, then?
Yes BB the aforementioned three had some commonalities but Lanza was different in the victims he chose. Shooting up an elementary school of first-graders is indeed an extremely rare occurence so better focus would be on preventing mass shootings in general. I'm repeating myself but someone hellbent on using firearms is perfectly willing to break whatever laws you pass and that's the basic paradox or contradiction of gun control - CRIMINALS DON'T OBEY THE LAW!
ReplyDeleteDave Miller and others have said gun controllers don't really want to ban or take away all guns. Beg to differ, I think deep down they do.
ReplyDeleteRE: "CRIMINALS DON'T OBEY THE LAW!"
ReplyDelete..yeah, that's what makes them criminals. We help them a lot by allowing 'straw purchases' at unregulated ubiquitous gunshows.
I knew of folks who 'fenced' such
at gunshows. "The guy wore camo and had a Nazi tattoo, but what the heck, $$$$ is green.
....perfectly legal, under current
law.
Weren't the Columbine shooters on antidepressants?
ReplyDeleteColumbine shooters?
ReplyDelete..interesting post analysis, we can draw our own conclusions .
Columbine HS had two armed guards.
ReplyDeleteSo much for the NRA crap .
Maybe what we're doing is protecting the pharmaceutical industry and we should be having that conversation instead of gun control 24/7. Yeah I heard that too about the armed guards but have to say BB the NRA suggestion is not a bad one even if you disagree. I don't think it's off the charts the way it's been portrayed. It's their other stuff like having a national database of the mentally ill that sends willies up my spine:)
ReplyDeleteSo I guess let's not blame the perpetually drugged state.
ReplyDeletehaving a national database of the mentally ill that sends willies up my spine:)
ReplyDeleteNothing like stigmatizing mental illness even further.
And in new news, in North Carolina you need a background check to get food stamps.
Not to mention the vast majority of the so-called "mentally ill" aren't even violent so such a database serves what?
ReplyDeleteJust makes it more of a stigma. Now I think they're talking that only people who are adjudicated or otherwise committed will be in the database. I understand wanting to keep the violent weaponless, but I think the stigma will just increase.
ReplyDeleteIt's interesting too that conservatives who normally push some variant of libertarianism change course and re Newtown issues now are all in favor for increasing the Power of the State to commit some of the mentally ill. As I said elsewhere if you're against the power of the state you're against the power of the state. Nobody's consistent.
ReplyDeleteBecause by leaning on the mentally ill you distract from the rest of it. It's very comforting to believe that all gun violence is committed by people who are violently mentally ill and that THOSE PEOPLE are the ones who need to be catalogued, databased, restricted. The truth is much less comforting: the vast majority of people with mental illness are nonviolent. The mentally ill are actually far more likely to be victims of violence (from others as well as self directed) than to be perpetrators of it. But that means that you have to look again at the rest of it, and that's not politically expedient.
ReplyDeleteI wanted to throw this out at you since we talk about health promotion and so on, here is a link to a page that has a recipe for a 'super cleansing tonic'. Now I have just made this a few minutes ago. The page states the goal is to work your way up to a shotglass of this stuff every day. I don't know if I can do such a thing but I will tell you that it makes a kickin salad dressing with some EVOO. I didn't strain mine and I didn't put it in 30oz of ACV. I blended everything with the ACV but didn't have a container big enough (or a funnel small enough to get it back in the original container) so I'm going with about 16 oz of concentrate if you will and just cut it as needed with the ACV. I don't usually eat garlic so it is no exaggeration to say this stuff STANKS but with the way the pollen is and allergies off the chart I'm willing to try anything that might boost my immunity. Anyway here it is:
http://www.trueearthmama.com/super-cleansing-tonic.html
Ingredients and Directions
1 30 oz. bottle Organic Apple Cider Vinegar (I recommend Braggs ACV)
1/4 cup chopped Garlic
1/4 cup Onions
1/4 cup Habanero peppers (or hottest peppers you can find)
1/4 cup grated Ginger
1/4 cup grated Horseradish
2 T Turmeric
Blend ingredients together for a couple of minutes
Strain
Pour liquid back in bottle
Compost everything else!
You can store the tonic in a cupboard for long periods of time. No need to keep in the refrigerator. You can also use it mixed with olive oil for a salad dressing. Or a shot full on you stir fry.
**It is a good idea to wear gloves especially when handling the peppers as it is difficult to get the heat off of your hands!
*For sore throat, gargle a bit in the mouth and swallow.
*For an illness, such as a cold or flu, take about 2 droppers full or a Tablespoon every couple of hours.
*For daily immune support drink 2 droppers full/ 1Tablespoon every day. Build up tolerance to a shot glass full.
*Eat an orange, lemon, or lime slice after to ease the heat.
___
Let me know what you think...
It's hard to get the habanero juice off your hands, tell me about it! My Mom made a meal once, forget what it was but she threw a few habaneros in and I must've been handling them with my hands not realizing it then hit the john a little while later then had to go upstairs to the living room with a kind of weird groin heat. Don't mean to be TMI here just a cautionary tale:)
ReplyDeleteDrinking that stuff has to be akin to getting waterboarded....
ReplyDeleteI've shat enuf in my lifetime thank you very much but might be a good way of prepping for a colonoscopy.
ReplyDeleteIt's for immune support, silly boys.
ReplyDeleteYou too get the allergies? What a living hell! Reading though Rooibos tea, a red tea that comes from South Africa is good for those type ailments.
ReplyDeleteThis time of year in NC the pollen is flying so thick that it LITERALLY looks like smoke in the air and it piles up around drains and on every possible surface in such volume that it looks like chalkboard dust. Every year my allergies get worse.
ReplyDeleteRooibos, Celestial Seasonings has a couple of very nice teas made of this.
Anyway I have found that it's easier to do my immune drink if I toss it down like tequila. I added a tablespoon of crushed Thai pepper flakes to it. It's mighty hot.
Now that I think about it, it kinda warms you from the inside out, like when you have a good mouthful of bourbon.
ReplyDeleteWell apparently gun control isn't going anywhere. I really do think conservatives and the NRA see guns like cell phones, you have the right to go out and get one. IMO the right to own a firearm is one of the least absolute rights you have. You can make the case that it's a right with many caveats but again for most conservatives the cell phone analogy seems to kick in.
ReplyDelete