It seems that everything has to interconnect these days, Politics and Sports in this case and some conservative commentators are making it out like liberals making fun of NFL quarterback Tim Tebow's religiosity is a war on Christianity itself. He blesses himself and prays before the game or something and thanks God at press conferences. Not the first athlete to do this nor the last, you'd think it was never done before. Yeah liberals never miss a chance at a cheap shot but the Larger Point missed as usual is that
God doesn't care about a damn football game:)
You're absolutely right. God doesn't care about a football game.
ReplyDeleteBut the reason I hate Tim Tebow is because you never see him thanking his Lord and Savior after he's LOST a game.
And in my book that makes him a hypocrite and a liar.
And I hope to hell whoever they play next turns him into an extra hashmark.
Maybe you should read this, Saty:
ReplyDeletehttp://www.nfl.com/news/story/09000d5d82533f7d/article/tebows-day-not-ruined-by-highprofile-loss-to-patriots
I absolutely love Tim Tebow and love that he wants to be a positive role model for kids. No, he isn't the first athlete to speak openly about God, but he recognizes that being a professional athlete in a leadership role has given him a wonderful platform to speak about his faith. And since he has been given much attention, I applaud him for using it to share his beliefs.
Methinks if he shared Saty's religious beliefs, she wouldn't feel the way she does. She just resents him because he is a Christian. And she is not alone, sad that someone feels the need to tear others down to prop themselves above others.
I resent him because he's Christian?
ReplyDeleteDo you really have that much of a religious persecution complex that you choose to believe that me criticizing Tim Tebow means I resent Christians as a group?
Geez. If there are other Christians who share this viewpoint it would go a long way towards explaining a lot.
Let me extrapolate a bit further. There are plenty of reasons for me to hate Tim Tebow, one of which I've already enumerated, but let's start with a basic one: he plays for Denver.
ReplyDeleteNow, I'm not sure how much you follow football, but being rabidly loyal to the Raider Nation, division rivalries run deep and hard. I'm going to hate Denver and anyone who plays there simply on that basis even if I can't find another reason to.
I also can't stand Pittsburgh and I am anxiously awaiting the day that someone does a Discount Doublecheck on Aaron Rodgers that turns him into a green and yellow smear on the turf. But the team I hate more than any other is the Miami Dolphins.
Maybe it's a Raiders thing; if you know anything about them, you know there's a definite attitude about it all from Al on down that I have always shared (and was a huge part of me getting into the Raiders in the first place) and I have always felt that 'STFU and play' ought to be Raider Rule #3.
When somebody puts the beatdown on Tebow (and it's coming, trust me) will you claim that they did it because they resent Christians?
Methinks you don't follow football.
And one more thing. Since I'm pretty sure you don't follow football, maybe you're not aware that one of the absolute greatest defensive ends of all time, Reggie White, was a very religious man (so much so that his nickname was 'The Minister of Defense'), a Messianic Jew, who learned Hebrew so he could study Torah in its original and who was also an Evangelical minister.
ReplyDeleteReggie White was a great man who did great things off the field and legendary stuff on it.
So much for this 'resenting Christians' thing. Not I nor anyone else I've ever heard has had a bad word to say about Reggie White, although I'm sure the players who got the beatdown had a few choice words at the time.
All this 'resenting Christianity' thing is just another way for Christians to feed their paranoia that the world is out to get them. I've never seen more persecution complex so rampant among a group of people in my life.
Let me extrapolate a little Saty. Let's say there was somebody just as religiously open as Tim Tebow, oh I don't know we'll call him Moussa for short, star quarterback and he gets down on his prayer mat before every game and thanks Allah at press conferences and then some conservative or two has a problem with dat, why this'd be an example of rabid anti-Muslim sentiment right? The libs would be out in force to defend Moussa, just sayin'.
ReplyDeleteNot particularly, though I think it would depend on exactly what kind of criticism he was facing.
ReplyDeleteMost football fans are of the 'STFU and play' opinion. Just like political opinions, religious opinions don't in my opinion have any place in football. Just play the damn game.
I knew you'd be around. I feel the same way about work, people shouldn't bring up politics in the workplace. Somebody brought up abortion once and I said to the chef with all the work to do and not only that get ten people in a room and they'll all have ten different views on the subject. There's too much to do, JUST WORK dammit!
ReplyDeleteApparently tebowing is a
ReplyDeletegrowing fad...
Only for people who don't drink.
ReplyDeleteDidn't read the link I see.
ReplyDeleteBefore there was Tebowing...
ReplyDeletehttp://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Thinker
What a Stupid Thing to be Angry about. Hatred, if felt at all, should be Preserved for Things that Actually cause Injury to others. I don't Hardly think that this Qualifies.
ReplyDeleteSoap: LMAO..
ReplyDeleteLista: obviously you're not a football fan either.
Well, I don't see what being a Football Fan or not has to do with Hatred towards someone who puts Scripture Verses under his Eyes and Kneels to Pray before a Football Field. I Fail to see how that Injures anyone. No One is Forcing anyone to Look Up the Verses. If they do so, it is of their own Free Will. Whatever.
ReplyDeleteI have to agree with Lista on this one, and if you read the link I gave, you would take back your original criticism, Saty, which was indeed WRONG.
ReplyDeleteAnd how does you telling about Reggie White excuse your unfair comments about Tim Tebow?
Because you choose to imagine that I 'resent Christians'. I realize it fits your particular worldview that Christians are persecuted by American society, and so to imagine that because I think someone needs to lay him out I somehow resent Christians as a group can validate that for you, but that's all just the product of your own mind.
ReplyDeleteEnjoy it if you like, though. I'm just waiting for the day he gets the big hit. And he will.
Like I said, Lista, it's my opinion that politics and religion don't belong on a football field. They need to just STFU and play.
And actually I wonder how you ladies would be reacting if we were discussing Moussa, the Muslim wide receiver who prays to Allah before, during, and after the game, and who quotes the Quran in postgame interviews and has Arabic verses written on his sneakers.
ReplyDeleteYour reasoning makes absolutely no sense, and I certainly would not react towards anyone of any religion like you have, I would never hope for harm upon another, good Christians don't do that.
ReplyDeleteThe Idea that you have any Valid Reason for Hating Tebow, Satyavati, is what is "the Product of your Own Mind".
ReplyDeleteTo Repeat Over and Over again, as I'm sure you are going to, that we have some Imaginary Worldview about Persecuted Christians that Needs Validating is not going to Make it so.
It just so Happens that Hatred for no Valid Reason is a Form of Persecution and you are Showing very Clear Evidence of just this sort of Hatred. If you have a Reason that Actually Makes sense other then his Christianity then Please Present it, yet none of the Reasons that you have Presented make any sense.
"Like I said, Lista, it's my opinion..."
That's Right. It's your Opinion and to Hate someone who has a Different Opinion is not a Valid Reason for Hatred, even if the Person Acts on that Differt Opinion and for him to Honor your Request to ST%#U would be to Forfeit his Right to the Freedom of Speech.
I Wonder why Moussa has not gotten any Media Coverage. Which do you Think is more Prevalent; the Attack on the Free Speech of Muslims or the Attack on the Free Speech of Christians? The Very Fact that no one is Complaining about Moussa Points Clearly to the Answer. Thanks for Making that Point for me.
You are Absolutely Right, Beth, that she is Making no Sense. I Actually Wonder why I Bother Talking with her when she gets this way.
Actually, Satyavati, I Acknowledge that you do not Hate all Christians. You Only Hate the Ones who Exercise their Right to the Freedom of Speech.
ReplyDeleteWell, it just so Happens that Hindering the Freedom of Speech of a Certain Group is a Form of Persecution. Just because there is no actual Violence Going on does not Mean that this does not Qualify as Persecution.
If your Hatred is not Directed at his Christianity, though, then why do you not also Hate Moussa. Beth and I do not Hate Moussa either, nor do we Hate Tebow.
Ah, apparently yall didn't actually read Z's comment about Moussa, the HYPOTHETICAL Muslim football player. I suppose it was easy to miss in the eagerness to find something to comment about.
ReplyDeleteMoussa is a hypothetical construct that Z came up with to illustrate a point. That's why there hasn't been any media coverage nor complaints, Lista.. he doesn't exist.
Now, all I can say is this: obviously neither of you know any rabid football fans. If you did, you'd understand. (I guess no good Christians are rabid football fans, Beth. The ones I know have decals on their trucks, you know, the ones with the little boy pissing on whatever? In these decals, it's usually whatever team their team has the greatest rivalry with. I guess they're not good Christians, or they wouldn't be harbouring such hatred, huh?)
Yall just don't understand football. Or division rivalries. Or the Oakland Raiders.
It's okay, I don't mind.. Ignorance is a valid excuse.
A boy pissing on a team's logo is hardly on par with your comments, Saty:
ReplyDelete"I hate Tim Tebow"
"I hope to hell whoever they play next turns him into an extra hashmark"
"I'm just waiting for the day he gets the big hit."
And I am a Cleveland Browns fan, so I know rivalries. Teams like the Steelers are rivals, but I would never say the comments you said above about any player from the Steelers, ever. John Elway and "The Drive" that knocked the Browns out of the playoffs still makes me ill thinking about, but never would I have wished John Elway bodily harm. And I obviously don't hate the current Broncos because of what happened against them years ago. And it sucked what happened when Baltimore stole our team, do I like them to lose? Sure, I don't like it that they are (way) better than the Browns, but I don't hate the players for doing their job and doing it well. Hopefully someday the tides will turn, and we'll have our day in the sun.
Basically, I think you've dug yourself in one big hole by showing your true colors of hatred in your original posting here, and now you are trying to make Lista and I seem unreasonable to cover up your hatred. Sad, in my opinion, that people like you exist in this world, but I don't hate you.
Not to mention that you lied in your original posting, and when I showed proof, you could have really shown some maturity and said you were sorry about what you said. You chose not to. That says a lot about you. Volumes.
You don't have to like Tim Tebow or really anyone, Saty, but I can't stand liars, and I really can't stand people who can't accept responsibility for their actions or their words, especially when they were wrong and cannot admit it.
I think maybe yall just don't exactly understand that football is a violent kind of game, full contact sport, the equivalent of automobile collisions over and over on the field. It's essentially a war game, and people get hurt. That's the game. And it engenders that kind of emotion and mentality. On January 2, 2012, Hue Jackson, head coach of the Oakland Raiders, said in an interview:
ReplyDelete"I'm pissed at my team. At some point in time as a group of men you go in the game and you can say whatever you want about coaches, you win the game....
"The killer instinct has got to exist here."
Killer instinct. That's the Oakland Raiders. This isn't bowling or baseball. It's football.
I see you chose to dig yourself deeper into the hole.
ReplyDeleteI have no idea what religion Tom Brady practices, or if he practices religion at all.
ReplyDeleteAnyway, I'll be cheering on my beloved Pats against the Broncos on Saturday and hope Brady is the victor. And if he isn't, Jesus, Allah, Yahweh or The Flying Spaghetti Monster will have had nothing to do with it.
Aside from being personal things, religion and politricks have their place. I think that point is lost on a lot of people.
ReplyDeleteYeh, Beth, and I don't Think I have a shovel Big Enough to Help Dig Satyavati back out again. Within Christianity, Nothing Justifies Hatred. Jesus Loves her, though, and can Dig her out of any Hole that she Digs, no Matter how Deep. We'll just have to Pray for her.
ReplyDeleteShaw Kenawe,
I'm not so sure that Prayers for Victory are what are being said. What is much more Common is Prayers for Peace of Mind, Playing with Good Attitudes and with Good Sportsmanship, Doing One's absolute Best and Opportunities to Share God's Love with People. Once this is Understood, whether or not One Wins is not Important any more in Order to Validate One's Faith.
"Within Christianity, Nothing Justifies Hatred."
ReplyDeleteSeems to me there are a flurry of Christian politicians who have quite a bit of hatred for certain parts of the world where a certain religion exists.
“I guess, first and foremost I’d like to thank my Lord and Savior, Jesus Christ,” Tebow told reporters after rallying his team to another comeback victory, 13-10, over the Chicago Bears.
ReplyDeleteBroncos quarterback Tim Tebow discusses Denver’s 41-23 loss to the Patriots:
“Well, first and foremost I have to thank my lord and savior, Jesus Christ, first, and, I also want to thank my teammates for the effort that they played with all day.
DENVER - To no one's surprise, Denver Broncos quarterback Tim Tebow has thanked his "Lord and Savior Jesus Christ" after the team's 29-23 overtime victory over the Pittsburgh Steelers in the NFL playoffs.
I congratulate Tebow for being even-handed in thanking his lord and savior both for wins and losses.
Oh, I forgot this about Tebow bowing and putting his hand to his head while thanking his lord and savior after every win or loss:
ReplyDelete"And when you pray, do not be like the hypocrites, for they love to pray standing in the synagogues and on the street corners to be seen by men. I tell you the truth, they have received their reward in full. But when you pray, go into your room, close the door and pray to your Father, who is unseen. Then your Father, who sees what is done in secret, will reward you.”
Matthew 6:5-6
Oh, my apologies. Tebow is equitable in his thanks. We don't have TV anymore so I must have missed it.
ReplyDeleteI still believe that politics and religion have no place in the game of football, in any sport, or like Z said, in any workplace whatsoever... and I am still anxiously awaiting the day he gets The Big Hit.
Yep. Me and half of America.
Jesus loves me, and Krishna loves you, Lista.
ReplyDeleteOh, my apologies. Tebow is equitable in his thanks. We don't have TV anymore so I must have missed it.
ReplyDeleteOr you could have gone to the link I provided and apologized a lot sooner.
An atheist quoting the Bible, that's rich. Maybe you should have kept reading Matthew.
ReplyDeleteMatthew 7:1-5 says:
“Do not judge, or you too will be judged. For in the same way you judge others, you will be judged, and with the measure you use, it will be measured to you.
“Why do you look at the speck of sawdust in your brother’s eye and pay no attention to the plank in your own eye? How can you say to your brother, ‘Let me take the speck out of your eye,’ when all the time there is a plank in your own eye? You hypocrite, first take the plank out of your own eye, and then you will see clearly to remove the speck from your brother’s eye.
Or you could stop reading the Daily Kos to get your religious teachings. Tim Tebow is not praying to be a hypocrite, like the Pharisees who are being addressed in Matthew 6:5-6, he is giving praise and thanksgiving to God. There's nothing wrong with that.
Another interesting thread, I'll get back to this.
ReplyDeleteHe's praying that Brian Urlacher doesn't get through his offensive linemen.
ReplyDeleteBeth wrote: "An atheist quoting the Bible, that's rich."
ReplyDelete"In US, atheists know religion better than believers. Is that bad?
A new study shows that many devout Americans know less about religion than do atheists. To some observers, it suggests a shallowness of faith. To others, it is evidence that Americans know the spirit better than the letter of religion."
SOURCE
In case the link doesn't work:
ReplyDelete"The US Religious Knowledge Survey, released Tuesday from the Pew Forum on Religion & Public Life, found atheists and agnostics know more basic facts about the Bible than either Protestants or Catholics."
Christian Science Monitor, Sept. 2010
Well then maybe you know the verse that says something about not bragging about yourself, which one was that?
ReplyDeleteBeth, when you lose an argument, you always misdirect.
ReplyDeleteI used the passage from Matthew to show that according to the NT, Jesus did not think much of people who made a big show of how pius they were in public.
You came back and snarked that it was rich to see an atheist quoting the Bible.
I linked to a study that showed, in fact, that atheists know more about religion than do religionists.
You come back with more sarcasm about bragging?
On of the most learned persons on the Bible on this planet was Christopher Hitchens, an atheist.
Being an atheist has absolutely nothing to do with a person's ability to do scholarship, as your snide remark implied, and which my rebuttal proved wrong.
Instead of acknowledging this fact, you misdirected with another unconnected snark.
Next time, try using facts.
+1
ReplyDeleteSo, does that mean you don't know the answer?
ReplyDeleteTry Matthew 23:12, or didn't you read that far?
ReplyDeleteI for one, being a life long fan of the Angels, and for many years a fan of the Dodgers, have always hated the Yankees in baseball.
ReplyDeleteI hated the Celtics too and still do.
I hated Georgia Frontiere for destroying the LA Rams and then moving them to St Louis.
I am not so sure that "hate" in a sporting sense rises to a level of hate that equates with how people feel about politicians of the other party.
It's sports... of course we hate the opposition, but we don't hate them...
As for Tebow, I am just sick of all the attention such an average QB is getting.
He is a great role model, for that I am happy. I wish more sports stars were like that, but he does come across as sanctimonious to me with all of his public religiosity...
Really Dave? Would you criticize Jesus if He came back to earth for being too religious in public?
ReplyDeleteAnyway, why do people "hate" teams that are successful? Isn't it really jealousy that our team isn't that good?
ReplyDeleteIf you're a football team and you're not the Oakland Raiders, I hate you.
ReplyDeleteDon't matter to me how 'successful' you are, I hate you anyway.
There's degrees of sports hate. I don't hate them all equally. Division rivals get it the worst. Them and the Miami Dolphins. I hate the Cowboys. I don't like Pittsburgh though I do think Tomlin is a cool customer and I have a secret crush on Polamalu (it's the hair). I hate them both, but if I have to choose I will take the Jets over the Giants because I think Rex Ryan's pretty badass. I LOVE Ray Lewis because he's a tremendous student of the game, he's got a lot of natural leadership and because he's an absolute animal on the field. Except when we play them. Probably the best compliment I could give him is to say I think he'd make a great Raider. My husband is a Saints fan so that makes for a lot of fun trash talk going on (I can make a lot of swamp jokes). Of course I hate the Saints. Of course he hates the Raiders.
The only people who don't hate anyone in sports are the ones who don't love anyone in sports.
Dave gets it.
Of course in full disclosure I should say that I despise the entire sport of baseball. I love the throwback uniforms (I think the knickers should be mandatory) but the rest of the game I can pretty much do without.
We watch an episode of America's Game almost every day. L C Greenwood (Steelers) was talking about how football is a violent game and you go out there to hit people...he said, it don't matter if it's mama playin on the other team, if mama's in the way... mama's gonna get hit.
ReplyDeleteOr listen to Deacon Jones talk about that head slap he perfected. Or even better.. Phil Villapiano. They didn't call Mean Joe mean for nothin. Did you ever see footage of Mike Singletary on the line of scrimmage? I wouldn't want to be in those crosshairs.. he has the rabid dog look going on.
It's football. Without all that violence it'd be as exciting as... baseball.
Oh, and I should point out that I live in NC, where college basketball is so huge and sports hate is on a whole other plane. You got UNC, you got Duke, and you got State. Then of course there's ECU but they're nobody. The Duke/UNC thing is off the chart. One day I took the baby to Duke and I had mistakenly dressed him in Carolina blue, and we heard it ALL DAY LONG from EVERYONE from housekeeping to doctors. Flat strangers will trash talk you if you're wearing the wrong team's shirt. Oh, it's major. Seriously major.
ReplyDeleteMakes me hating Tebow look like piddle.
I didn't get any sleep before I went to work last night.
I don't have the Time Right Now to Read and Respond to all 10 of the Comments that came in since I visited Last, but I do want to Respond to Shaw Kenawe, 9:32 PM.
ReplyDeletePerhaps, Shaw, Beth Snarked because you Quoted from a Book that you do not Believe in, not that you Quoted something that you are not Familiar with. It just so Happens, though, that there are a lot of Contrasts in the Bible. The Verse that you Quoted from Matthew Points to the Fact that we are not to Flaunt our Christianity in Public, yet there is another Verse, also in Matthew, that says...
"Let your light so shine before men, that they may see your good works, and glorify your Father which is in heaven." (Matthew 5:16, KJV)
When ever we see Apparent Contradictions in the Bible, what it usually comes down to is Attitude of Heart, rather then an Actual Behavior. What Beth Quoted, though, is not really Off Subject because it Points to the Fact that we are not to Judge, or more Specifically to this Context, we are not to Judge the Attitudes and Motives of People's Hearts, because Only God Knows what is Actually in the Heart.
Getting back to Shaw's observation it's interesting that atheists would know more about religion. I'm wondering why this is so though. Since I don't believe in mermaids and warlocks I know very little about them.
ReplyDeleteZ-man,
ReplyDeleteHere is a Possible Explanation. Atheists Know a lot about the Bible because they are Obsessed with Trying to Disprove it. You don't Know much about Mermaids and Warlocks because you do not Consider them a Threat. Atheists are very Threatened by our Beliefs because Deep Down they Know that there is Power there and this Scares them.
Atheists and agnostics typically test better on knowledge of all religions. It is interesting and I doubt Lista's explanation. 45 % of Catholics didn't understand transubstantiation and 43% of Jews
ReplyDeletedidn't know who Maimonides was.
..thought everyone knew that stuff...
I can tell you that I know a good deal more about the Bible and what's in it than many of the good and faithful Christians I am around. And the reason is that when I was at that point in my life when I was doing some searching, I read it. In four different translations. Not like reading a novel, I was studying it because I was at a very critical time in my life, I had left the RC church (which isn't a lot about the Bible, let's admit it) and I was trying to figure out where I was going from there. So I was actually studying very hard.
ReplyDeleteI read a lot of religious writings while I was working through all this. I had a policy of not reading ABOUT various groups but reading what they had themselves. IOW, rather than read about the JW, I read their own books, their own Bible translation. I read Dianetics rather than read everything everyone else wrote about the Scientologists. I read the Quran, and the Book of Mormon and so on and so forth. I did spend the most time on the Bible because that was where I'd started.
Ultimately it wasn't where I ended up. But study never goes to waste. It had nothing to do with any anti-Christian sentiment, it was a very personal search and study to determine my spiritual path for the rest of my life. It didn't have all the answers for me so I continued on elsewhere, but that research, study time and knowledge are still very valuable.
I would venture to say that many people learn about the Bible under some of the same circumstances I did, and just at the end of their research, find that a Supreme Person is not a concept they can honestly put faith in, and they become atheists.
Sounds like a good explanation but I'm geared more towards Lista's theory which BB discounts (not sure what BB's thesis is though). I just wiki'd Mormonism and while I am not a Mormon I have to admit it made for some very interesting reading and I can see becoming knowledgeable about it even if you don't believe in it, same deal with the Bible I guess. Question being why do atheists and agnostics keep going back to the Good Book? so much so they can probably whiz by if the category on Jeopardy is Religion.
ReplyDeleteI could probably sit right now for a Comparative Religion final and get an A.
ReplyDeleteWhat makes you think they keep going back?
Apart from that, it is often helpful to quote Bible verses to people who take the Bible as their authority. The difficulty comes in that those people choose to interpret said verses in whatever way suits them best. Kind of negates the whole idea of having a scripture considered authoritative, but that's just me. Another issue is that the Bible tends to contradict itself in places, which allows an individual to decide which verse suits their purpose best.
We accept the validity of the Bible as an authorized scripture, but it isn't considered on the same level as Srimad Bhagavatam and Bhagavad Gita, which for us would be the top authority.
and THIS... is CLASSIC...
ReplyDeletehttp://youtu.be/NHB0o9lCizQ
oh, you must. Do it now.
"Let your light so shine before men, that they may see your good works, and glorify your Father which is in heaven." (Matthew 5:16, KJV)"
ReplyDeleteLista, doing good works is not the same as showing off and being publicly pious. There's no contradictions in the two verses, since the verses deal with two different things.
Also, Z-man perhaps a lot of atheists know the Bible and a lot about other religions because they were raised to learn the Bible and know religion and then rejected them.
Lista: "Atheists are very Threatened by our Beliefs because Deep Down they Know that there is Power there and this Scares them."
How on earth can you know what atheists believe "deep down?" Unless you are a doubter yourself? What you're doing, Lista, is projecting your guesses about atheists and turning these unfounded guesses into what YOU believe.
Atheists don't "fear" the Bible or religion. We reject what both say is inerrant truth. We do not reject its poetry and some of its teachings about being good to each other and helping each other. Though one doesn't need a bible to know that it is better to do good rather than evil.
Even among the great apes, altruism and empathy have been observed. That is apparently part of how we primates behave.
Actually, Beth, success has nothing to do with it, as far as teams go...
ReplyDeleteDoesn't matter how crappy the Yankees might be, I'm still gonna hate 'em.
Doesn't matter how good or bad any team is that plays Da Raiders, Saty's gonna hate 'em.
It's sports.
It's just like when every true blue American hated the Russian Basketball team in 1972 when we were cheated out of the Gold Medal. Our Silver Medals are still in the Olympic vault, because we refused to accept them, because they cheated and everyone knew it.
Again, it's sports hate...
Now for your Jesus snark... really? You've read my blogs and my comments and you think I'd would criticize Jesus?
I'll criticize people for claiming him as Lord and Saviour and not trying to live a life worthy of Him maybe... but Jesus himself... really, you got that from what I wrote?
WOW...
What's with the "snark" word these days, sheesh!
ReplyDeleteYes, Dave, I have read your blog, which is precisely why I was surprised at your criticism of Tim Tebow. A person doesn't have to go to Mexico to preach the Good News.
You all gotta admit that because of Tim Tebow, 60 comments here from a variety of denominations and even an atheist are talking about religion because of him, and the whole country, as well. I think that's pretty cool, and makes me admire Tim Tebow even more.
I was never so happy to see New England win a game in my life.
ReplyDeleteDave,
ReplyDeleteBeth will extrapolate from whatever comment you write whatever suits the purpose of her argument best.
Don't forget: at the beginning of all this, she decided I hate Tim Tebow because he's Christian and not a Hare Krishna....
And Lista decided it was because I don't like Christians who exercise their right to free speech (and that because I didn't complain about Moussa the Muslim QB it proved her point.. until she discovered Moussa doesn't exist).
Whatever you say around here can and will be modified by the opposition to suit their needs regardless of accuracy.
As a Clevelander, I am rather used to the team I want to win not winning. So, looks like I'll be watching the Super Bowl for the commercials...again. Oh well, as we say here in Cleveland (all the time), maybe next year.
ReplyDeleteI much prefer baseball over football so I'm the opposite of Saty. I've watched the occasional football game and even as a kid growing up I always thought for a timed game this game sure drags on way too long. Most times they get a few yards and get tackled, bunch of men in a pile over and over and 60 Minutes is coming on late again. Baseball is more artful, even intellectual not just a game of smashface, letting testoterone get the best of you. BTW I think hunting is a stupid sport what with all the bear hunts or proposed bear hunts in NJ and CT in the news of late. I wouldn't ban it by law but to me it takes no special skill to shoot a defenseless critter in the woods. I'm not even coming at this from an animal rights perspective just talking about some things I consider stupid just to change subject yet again.
ReplyDeleteI used to really get into the games. Then I got older, the games became less about entertainment and more about money, and then they started to fleece taxpayers to subsidize their enterprise. I since have very little interest.
ReplyDeleteI've heavily drifted away from baseball for similar reasons and also the whole wild card thing. I also hate Derek Jeter because he's never been rejected by a woman.
ReplyDeleteEven though I haven't Been by this Post in Quite Awhile, I have been By on Occasion Reading and Taking Notes.
ReplyDeleteBack Tracking quite a bit, Let us First Compare the Two Verses that were Quoted by Shaw Kenawe and then by me and then by Beth.
Shaw
"5) And whenever you pray, do not be like the hypocrites; for they love to stand and pray in the synagogues and at the street corners, so that they may be seen by others. Truly I tell you, they have received their reward. 6) But whenever you pray, go into your room and shut the door and pray to your Father who is in secret; and your Father who sees in secret will reward you." (Matthew 6:5-6, NRSV)
And…
Me
"In the same way, let your light shine before others, so that they may see your good works and give glory to your Father in heaven." (Matthew 5:16, NRSV)
The Key Words are "so that they may be seen by others" and "give glory to your Father in heaven" and these Phrases are all about motive.
Now for Beth's Quote…
"1) Do not judge, or you too will be judged. 2) For in the same way you judge others, you will be judged, and with the measure you use, it will be measured to you." (Matthew 7:1, NIV)
From this, we Learn that we should not Judge and this Includes the Judgment of other People's Motives, for Only God Knows what Lies within the Heart. So you see, this Verse Fits in Very Nicely with what is being Discussed. I do not see it as a Misdirection.
Shaw,
Apart from what I’ve just said, after Reading your Comment, I Noticed that you have Stressed the Difference between "Good Works" (Matthew 5:16) and "Prayer" (Matthew 6:5-6) and that's an Interesting Point.
Satyvati,
"He's praying that Brian Urlacher doesn't get through his offensive linemen."
Naturally Satyavati Knows all of Tebow's Thoughts and Prayers.
Let's see now, where am I?
ReplyDeleteRather or not Tim Tebow is a Hypocrite depends on his Motives and Only God Knows the Answer to that.
Beth,
"Isn't it really jealousy that our team isn't that good?"
Bingo! Quite Often that is the Answer.
I Think that the Word Hate is Over Used in the Sports sense and it Waters Down the Original Meaning of the Word. In Politics, when Things are Called "Hate Speech", something much more Malicious is Implied and yet the Real Truth of the Speech is Often nothing more than an Expressed Opinion and the Word Hate is an Exaggeration. That’s all we Need Right now, though; Another Confusion Over a Word and this time it is the Word "Hate".
Shaw, BB & Sayavati,
It's actually no Secret that many Christians just Take their Pastors, Ministers and Priest's Word for it, rather then doing the Study that they should. This doesn't Change the Fact, though, that there are those who have Studied and Know just as much as any Atheist and yet Choose Christianity after Completing their Study.
Satyavati,
"The difficulty comes in that those people choose to interpret said verses in whatever way suits them best."
What Makes you so sure that you are not doing Exactly the Same, Satyavati? Just because "Interpretation" is Denied, does not Mean that it has not Occurred. Personally, I Think that Interpretation is Inevitable.
Those who Deny such Interpretation, Claim that the Literal Meaning is Crystal Clear, but it is not. To Claim that the Meaning is Crystal Clear is nothing more then the Denial that your own Understanding of it is, In Fact, an Interpretation and Shows an Arrogance in that you believe that your Understanding of the Passage is Supreme.
Satyavati,
ReplyDelete"It didn't have all the answers for me."
You Said that is Reference to your Studies of Christianity. My Question though is this... Were you searching Answers to Specific Questions relating to Convenience, or were you Searching to Discover what is Truth? I Ask this because the Specific Questions Asked, could Lead a Person to Differing Conclusions, but Truth is Truth.
"Whatever you say around here can and will be modified by the opposition to suit their needs regardless of accuracy."
That is just as True as the Liberals as of the Conservatives, so don't Think that you are Exempt.
Before 'Praise The Lord' Tebow, there were just ol NFL players.
ReplyDeleteLike Aaron Rogers, packers QB:
" Monday marked just the most recent case as I had the unparalleled privilege to be a part of Aaron Rodgers charity event to benefit the MACC Fund, a charity towards eradicating childhood cancer and blood
disorders. Scattered throughout the crowd of rabid Packers aficionados, were the people who I consider the event's real MVPs. They are the families who've been forced to deal with one of life's toughest sentences - the
loss of a child.
My friend, the father of that young girl who passed away named Cheri,
was there that night. He was one of several attendees brought up on
stage where he caught a football thrown by the quarterback of the
Green Bay Packers.
He asked Aaron to sign the football he'd caught. He wondered if he'd make it out to his daughter Cheri. It isn't shocking that Rodgers obliged. What caught me off guard was the dedication he made. It wasn't until after Aaron left that I first saw the autograph... and the simple yet sweet message that brought tears to this father's eyes:
"To Cheri the angel. Save me a spot. - Aaron Rodgers" "
..I think Beth would like that.